IM Swim time prediction
My pool time (25yd long) compared to my IM Florida time varied by about 8-10minutes. The second lap was particularly choppy and I started in the middle, which added a bit more than I had hoped for.
"I run because it always takes me where I want to go" -Dean Karnazes
A wet suit alone can lop off 5 minutes or more on your time as can having to do with out turns. Having to struggle through a course full of other swimmers can can slow you a bit. Race day adreniline canmake you go faster but you might go out too fast leaving you to slow the second portion of the swim. I am sure someone out there can probably pull out some formula that will give you an exact time...but
I think you have to go to an IM swim with a ballpark range...say 1:10 to 1:20. That will help with positives and negatives that may pop up.
"What would life be if we had no courage to attempt anything?" - Vincent Van Gogh
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Just a quick question to all those with experience. Training for my first IM in FL 07. I just did the full 2.4 mile swim in 1:16 in a long course pool. Kept my pace comfortable etc.. Without accounting for improving fitness, but adding the wet suit, the draft potential, and the salt water, what would be a realistic improvement/estimate if I swam in the race conditions today?
I think so much depends on the water conditions on race day. In the week before this years IMFL, the water was so calm and beautiful, I felt like I was flying! I was hoping for about a :57 IM swim based on my pool times and on the course in that week. However, a couple of days before the race, the wind and swells moved in and the course got quite rough. My actual finish time was 1:03, a fair bit slower than I had hoped for. I felt like I had no glide and couldn't find a decent draft, was just getting thrown around out there. I discovered however that only 10 of the women's pros had faster times than that (and they don't have to deal with the mosh pit of 2000+ athletes), so although it felt slow, it was pretty good for the day, considering what the water was like. So it all depends on the conditions. You also have to factor in all of the people. At your pace, you'll be in the thick of things, and that will have an effect as well.
I'd say with smooth water + wetsuit, you could swim faster, but with rough water + lots of athletes, it could also go slower. Also take into account you have to get out and run on the beach through the timing gates and that's included in the swim time.
Blue Skies, -Robin-
http://ironmom.blogspot.com/
Here's the reverse question of this post. I am training for IMWI and am in base for the next few months, but one of the events I'm doing for the fun of it this year involves 4 separate events over a several month period. It starts with a 100yd swim next month, a 14 mile Time Trial in June, a 5 mile run in the fall and a x-country ski race next winter. Total time wins. The swim is converted so that every second in the water is 30 seconds of actual time. So a 60 second 100yd would be a 30 minute time. For the fun of it today at the end of an easy set of 7-100's (I'm in a recovery week) I tried a full out sprint. Started in the water and was swimming in a 20yd pool. I came in a 1:03 for the 100 (This would have been a 31:30 in the race). The actual race is in a regular 25yd pool and you can use starting blocks. My goal is 55 seconds, so for any experienced swimmers out there I was wondering if a 55 is within reach given it will be off blocks, in a longer pool and won't be in the middle of a workout. I'm not altering my IMWI plan at all for this race in any way, so I'm not really doing any sprint training at all.
Also, to get back on the track of this post for IM pacing, is one's times in a longer pool going to be better for times in a shorter pool for pacing? I'm pretty quick on my flip turns, but feel that if I was swimming in alonger pool my times would be quicker.
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2008 Main Races:
VA Beach Shamrock Marathon
Desoto TTT
WV Mountaineer HIM
IM Wisconsin
Shorter pool=quicker. The fastest you are travling is off the start and then every time, in short pool swiming is a sport of deceleration, so push your walls hard. When converting times, the general rule of thumb is to subtract one second of time per extra wall, and add a second for each less wall. So in a 25 yard pool your time would be closer to a 1:04. That said, I don't think a 55 is a completely unrealistic goal, mabie on the very edge of realistic though. Without doing any sprint training it could be a problem, but i can definitely see you going right around a minute, mabie under. The thing with swimming is that every second you take down the harder it is to go faster. That said spend a couple minutes trying starts at the end of your workout just to get the feel, it should help your time significantly.
Shorter pool=quicker. The fastest you are travling is off the start and then every time, in short pool swiming is a sport of deceleration, so push your walls hard. When converting times, the general rule of thumb is to subtract one second of time per extra wall, and add a second for each less wall. So in a 25 yard pool your time would be closer to a 1:04. That said, I don't think a 55 is a completely unrealistic goal, mabie on the very edge of realistic though. Without doing any sprint training it could be a problem, but i can definitely see you going right around a minute, mabie under. The thing with swimming is that every second you take down the harder it is to go faster. That said spend a couple minutes trying starts at the end of your workout just to get the feel, it should help your time significantly.
I was wondering if there was a conversion. I would hope a start from a block would also gain me a couple of seconds. When I swam years ago we had a 25 meter pool and my PB for 100m was around a 56-57, but that was 17 years ago! Overall, it is a very slow pool in that there are amost never any lane lines in it, it is only 4 lane and usually the afternoon crowd consists of me doing laps and 5-6 people doing aquarobics. Believe me, those people can get the little pool stirred up pretty choppy.
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2008 Main Races:
VA Beach Shamrock Marathon
Desoto TTT
WV Mountaineer HIM
IM Wisconsin
How straight is your stroke? What I see on race day is a lot of swimmers getting way off course, adding time. My pool times and race day times were about the same for my last IM. The wetsuit sped me up, but really choppy water and a slight zig zag took that time back. If you don't mind the people, stay to the inside and sight every 15-20 strokes. Don't sight as much if you can swim in a straight line.
It's so hard to predict IM swim, bike or run times. It's the same as saying, "I train at 22mph for 94 miles in the hills, what will my IM bike time be at AZ......?" There are so many outliers and extrenuous situations (not talking flats or bike mechanicals) that can't be accounted for in training.
For instance: in my area I can't get an open road for longer than about 10 miles before stop light after stop light. Therefore, it's almost impossible to gauge time predictions.
Based on your best time a 55 may be possible then. A 56.5 in meters converts to around a 50.8 in yards (pretty darn fast :D ), and even if it was 17 years ago, you have gone much faster, so i can definitely see you pulling out a 55 something.
Back on the IM swim. I just started reading about this Front Quadrant stuff. Granted I thought I was a strong swimmer al abit 15 years ago from 5 or 6 thru highschool mainly a sprinter. But for the most part i am no were near getting my "catch up" close to what Im seeing in some videos and others talking about Front Quadrant. Is this technique really that great??? I can try this with out a problem but is it worth changing my stroke???
Back on the IM swim. I just started reading about this Front Quadrant stuff. Granted I thought I was a strong swimmer al abit 15 years ago from 5 or 6 thru highschool mainly a sprinter. But for the most part i am no were near getting my "catch up" close to what Im seeing in some videos and others talking about Front Quadrant. Is this technique really that great??? I can try this with out a problem but is it worth changing my stroke???
My opinion: If you're not Front Quadrant swimming, you're probably not getting the most efficiency out of your stroke, especially for long distance swimming. When I work with a swimmer, I can usually improve their efficiency (as measured by Swim Golf score) by about 25% by moving them into the front quadrant for most of their stroke. It's all about the glide....
Short answer: Go for it!
Blue Skies, -Robin-
http://ironmom.blogspot.com/
Based on your best time a 55 may be possible then. A 56.5 in meters converts to around a 50.8 in yards (pretty darn fast :D ), and even if it was 17 years ago, you have gone much faster, so i can definitely see you pulling out a 55 something.
I'm really curious to see how I come in. It was also about 17 lbs ago too!
On the IM swim, I think your pool time should give you a definite idea of where you should come in at, but there are so many variables it's hard to tell. My longest race has been a half. About a week before I swam 1.2 in the pool in 29:30. In the race I had a wetsuit, so I was hoping for faster time, but it was very choppy so that slowed us down. I found a good person to draft off of, but we kept catching up to slow traffic in the water from the waves in front of us, so that didn't help. Final time out of the water, a comfortable 30:08. So for every plus, it seemed there was a negative so it all equalled out in the end.
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2008 Main Races:
VA Beach Shamrock Marathon
Desoto TTT
WV Mountaineer HIM
IM Wisconsin
Yeah, I agree you should be able to ball park your swim time. I did for my Half IM and was very close. I would err towrads being a little slower in the IM swim, regardless of the wet suit. The ideal conditions in the pool won't be there at the IM start. I train to swim in the pool faster so I can try and bank that at the race. A good indicator is if you can swim say 10x200 scy on the 3:00's or 10x100 scy on the 1:30's, most coaches would say you can bang out a 60min flat IM swim fairly easily....that's why I try and go 1:23 on the 100's, gives me wiggle room and piece of mind. :)
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Bryan
Of course it's 'effing hard, it's IRONMAN!
I train to swim in the pool faster so I can try and bank that at the race. A good indicator is if you can swim say 10x200 scy on the 3:00's or 10x100 scy on the 1:30's, most coaches would say you can bang out a 60min flat IM swim fairly easily....that's why I try and go 1:23 on the 100's, gives me wiggle room and piece of mind. :)
Same here, woring on being able to do a comfortable 120+/- at IMWI. I want to ingrain that pace/effort level between now and september and I know it will put me in a good place for the swim. Could maybe go a little faster, but if I can come without having exerted too hard then I figure I'll be in a good place after the swim and not too fatigued. One of my favorite workouts is to do a set of 15-20 100's on 1:30 working on my pace. I don't want to come in much more than 3 seconds from the slowest one to the fastest one. It really gives me a good feel for the effort level I'm putting out and where my time/pace should be.
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2008 Main Races:
VA Beach Shamrock Marathon
Desoto TTT
WV Mountaineer HIM
IM Wisconsin






Just a quick question to all those with experience. Training for my first IM in FL 07. I just did the full 2.4 mile swim in 1:16 in a long course pool. Kept my pace comfortable etc.. Without accounting for improving fitness, but adding the wet suit, the draft potential, and the salt water, what would be a realistic improvement/estimate if I swam in the race conditions today?
Thanks