Total Immersion 'Sweet Spot'
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rob6118 posted 1 year ago.
The whole body, the power of your stroke comes from your hips. In that drill if anything you are overemphasizing the body roll so yes your whole body should roll almost all the way on its side. Just make sure you do it smoothly and slowly, you don't want the length of your body to fishtail like a snake going through the water.
Rob
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Tikal Dog posted 1 year ago.
As rob said its the whole body that rotates. I you can get yourself the TI DVD. It cleared out a lot of doubts I had.
Is not the same reading the book and watching someone do it. It really helps.
Good luck.
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duffeymt posted 1 year ago.
Thanks guys...I am trying to get a hold of the DVD from the workshops. Can anyone get onto the Total Immersion Discussion boards? I get a bad link when I click on it.
http://totalimmersion.net/talk-back.html
http://webboard.totalimmersion.net:8080/~1/login
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Tikal Dog posted 1 year ago.
I havent´seen the one from the workshops so I can´t comment on that one (or those).
but freestyle made easy is the one I got and covers every drill.
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Ironmom posted 1 year ago.
You roll your whole body so that your hand resting on your leg comes out of the water, the DVD makes it a lot clearer than just the book.
But eventually when you incorporate these drills into a total stroke, make sure you aren't rolling like that to breathe! I see too many TI swimmers who roll way too much in their stroke. I find that swimmers can get more power by twisting from the hips, instead of turning in a way that includes the hips. It's like trying to hit a baseball or throw a punch - you want to twist from your hips, but not turn your whole body or you lose your power.
Blue Skies, -Robin-
http://ironmom.blogspot.com/
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Tikal Dog posted 1 year ago.
Ironmom sweetspot is not for breathing if you remember the video. Is a safespot you can go to if you need it.
Have never used it during a race or practice, but did help in the learning curve.
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Ironmom posted 1 year ago.
Tikal Dog;60256 wrote:
Ironmom sweetspot is not for breathing if you remember the video. Is a safespot you can go to if you need it.
.
Yes, but I end up seeing people who still roll all the way up to breathe. I think TI is a good method in general, but I've found as a swim coach that people who work through it themselves often have a similar set of issues. One of them tends to be rolling almost all the way over to breathe, and another is rolling too much in their stroke. I can often spot a TI swimmer in the pool simply by what they're doing.
That's not to say it's not a reasonable method, just to be aware of potential pitfalls if you're teaching it to yourself via book or video. I haven't taken one of their workshops, but I bet that they cover this kind of thing in more depth there.
Blue Skies, -Robin-
http://ironmom.blogspot.com/
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kona_expat posted 1 year ago.
When you are actually swimming, think "belly to the wall." You want your belly button and everything below it to be parallel to the wall on the side you are breathing to. But as you stroke, even if you don't breathe to a stroking side, you should be "belly to the wall" on that side.
I find that when I use this visualization technique that I achieve what Ironmom is describing, which is a rotation that is primarily in the hip region. Your upper body will naturally rotate to the extent that you are maintaining an extension of the stroking arm where it's extended straight out (i.e., you aren't crossing over your center line).
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Tikal Dog posted 1 year ago.
I agree!!! And if you do it right there should be no reason why you or anyone couldn´t be able to breath bilateral.
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duffeymt posted 1 year ago.
If you turn your belly button to the wall, wouldn't your lower legs rotate as well? That is some serious mobility if you can rotate your entire midsection to the wall with your legs remaining straight...
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Tikal Dog posted 1 year ago.
duffeymt;60291 wrote:
If you turn your belly button to the wall, wouldn't your lower legs rotate as well? That is some serious mobility if you can rotate your entire midsection to the wall with your legs remaining straight...
What you are describing sounds like a yoga pose man!;)
No realy....get the video! it will help you out a lot and you won´t get any more Rubber-Man images in your head!!!:D
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Ironmom posted 1 year ago.
kona_expat;60263 wrote:
When you are actually swimming, think "belly to the wall." You want your belly button and everything below it to be parallel to the wall on the side you are breathing to. But as you stroke, even if you don't breathe to a stroking side, you should be "belly to the wall" on that side.I find that when I use this visualization technique that I achieve what Ironmom is describing, which is a rotation that is primarily in the hip region. Your upper body will naturally rotate to the extent that you are maintaining an extension of the stroking arm where it's extended straight out (i.e., you aren't crossing over your center line).
That's actually the opposite of what I encourage people to do. I believe you lose a lot of power by turning your belly button and hips toward the wall. I like to see the hips relatively flat in the water, with only a slight rotation to the side. The rotation comes from the hips up, not hips down. A good visual is to think of hitting a baseball. Your upper body twists, like a spring building tension. When you strike, you unleash the tension of your torso "spring" into your arms, making your swing much more powerful than if it was arm-swing alone. If you turned your hips to the same extent as you rotated your torso, you would lose much of your power. The power comes from the twisting of the torso relative to the hips. The hips will twist some, but not nearly as much as the torso.
When I work with people, I sometimes have them punch the air in front of them with full arm extension. When you throw a punch correctly, it comes again from your torso power. Then I have them swim and carry that same sensation of punching from the torso into their arm stroke.
You can see in this video of Ian Thorpe how his hips stay mostly pointed down with just a slight twist, and how much power is coming from his torso: http://youtube.com/watch?v=rjbQp5fjBO0&search=ian%20thorpe At no point is his belly to the wall or his hips rotating to that extent. His kick remains relatively flat from his hips down, while his torso unleashes power.
Blue Skies, -Robin-
http://ironmom.blogspot.com/
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Tikal Dog posted 1 year ago.
Like Ironmom says even in the TI FAQ there are people asking why they promote such a motion if PROs don´t use it......
Go and search Terry´s answer. He says the most efficient rotation is a 45 degree one instead of a 90 degree like the drills show us. ALL THIS IN TERRY´S OWN WORDS.
BUT TI is a great way to start swimming don´t get me wrong.
And a 90 degree rotation WILL help you in learning to breath bilateral. Or at least it did with me.
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geochuck posted 1 year ago.
I have as much faith in what Terry says as I have in the stuff here http://www.watsu.com/ Just because Terry says it does not mean it is true. His thoughts change daily.
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RV posted 1 year ago.
Ironmom;60308 wrote:
That's actually the opposite of what I encourage people to do. I believe you lose a lot of power by turning your belly button and hips toward the wall. I like to see the hips relatively flat in the water, with only a slight rotation to the side. The rotation comes from the hips up, not hips down. A good visual is to think of hitting a baseball. Your upper body twists, like a spring building tension. When you strike, you unleash the tension of your torso "spring" into your arms, making your swing much more powerful than if it was arm-swing alone. If you turned your hips to the same extent as you rotated your torso, you would lose much of your power. The power comes from the twisting of the torso relative to the hips. The hips will twist some, but not nearly as much as the torso.When I work with people, I sometimes have them punch the air in front of them with full arm extension. When you throw a punch correctly, it comes again from your torso power. Then I have them swim and carry that same sensation of punching from the torso into their arm stroke.
You can see in this video of Ian Thorpe how his hips stay mostly pointed down with just a slight twist, and how much power is coming from his torso: http://youtube.com/watch?v=rjbQp5fjBO0&search=ian%20thorpe At no point is his belly to the wall or his hips rotating to that extent. His kick remains relatively flat from his hips down, while his torso unleashes power.
Hmmm...that is really interesting and makes sense too. I've been doing the belly to wall. Will have to give this a go.
RV
It takes a long time to get good. - Scott Molina
Slow is smooth; smooth is fast. - Rich Strauss
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geochuck posted 1 year ago.
Ironmom you have hit on one of my favorite swimmers, Thorpe. The other is Hackman. You cannot find 2 better to see.
Here are 2 very short videos of Thorpe http://www.eliteswimming.com/free5.shtml
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Pete L. posted 1 year ago.
You weren't kidding when you said very short. I spent the last hour watching swimming clips on youtube.
For anyone who is familiar with the TI drills...I have a question regarding the second drill, finding your sweet spot when balancing. When you roll to your side, exposing your shoulder through your knuckles, do you only roll your upper body and try to keep your lower body in the same position as it was from the start? Or do you roll your entire body so everything including your legs are turned towrds the side a bit? Thanks!
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