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Swim training for triathlons

sparknote_s's picture
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started by sparknote_s on June 5, 2006

Currently I am doing workouts around 3,000 yards 3 days / week training for sprint triathlons. For ex:

8x100 on 1:30 interval
4x200 on 3:00 interval
2x400 on 6:00 interval
1x800 on 12:00

Or should I be doing shorter but faster workouts?

bigdogtwo's picture
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bigdogtwo posted 2 years ago.

My swim coach has me switching things up more. I rotate thru the following workouts:

1. Long slow swim w/out stopping. Usually 3000 - 3500 yards. Sometimes longer.
2. 1500 yrd time trial at race pace.
3. 10x100 on 2:00 10x50 on 1:00. With warmup and cooldown of 500 yards or so each.
4. warmup/drills 700 yards. 2000 yards of stroke counting drills. For instance a 5x25 with the following stroke counts: 13 - 14 - 15 -16- 17. Then do 17 - 16 - 15 - 14 - 13. etc. 300 warmdown.
5. A few others similar to 4, above.
6. Coundown swim: 600, 500, 400, 300, 200, 100 with descending 100 split times.

I have put the workouts on little sheets of paper and then laminated them with sticky pages you can get at office max.

RV's picture
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RV posted 2 years ago.

Ya, don't want to do the same workout over and over - good to switch up the efforts. You may also want to incorporate some drill work into you workouts. i.e. position drills and propulsion drills.

RV

It takes a long time to get good. - Scott Molina
Slow is smooth; smooth is fast. - Rich Strauss

glbrum's picture
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glbrum posted 2 years ago.

You seem to have the endurance base down pretty good, so I'd work on speed. In those intervals are you coming in on 1:30 for the 100's or are you leaving on the 1:30? Because you are not in the pool that much (9,000yds/week is not a lot) you need to make it a lot of fast workouts. Think of it like this: if you only spent 3 hours a week on the bike, would you be doing LSD rides or bust-your-ass intervals and speed sets. Hopefully the latter to get the most out of your time spent. Same with the swim. Spend about 75% of the time doing speedwork (100's, 200's, maybe even 50's) Ocassionaly do some longer sets (400,500) for pacing. Can you get another day in the pool? That would be pretty helpful to you.

sparknote_s's picture
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sparknote_s posted 2 years ago.

For those intervals I am leaving on 1:30. Coming in on 1:15 or 1:20. That was just an example of an easy endurance workout.

For speed work I do pace stuff something like:

5x100 on 1:35 interval, but at your 1000 goal pace (like 1:05). So I try to come in on 1:05 but don't leave until 1:35. Then do an easy 200. Repeat that 3 times.

Oh, plus a warm up and cool down.

Variations of stuff like that, maybe 200s, etc.

This good for speed work?

glbrum's picture
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glbrum posted 2 years ago.

You are definitely WAY faster than I. I find it easier to leave on the :30 or the :00, but if :35's work for you than do it. I think to really build more speed, do more than 5 repeats in a row. Work up to 10 or 20.

A workout I've been doing lately is 500w/u, 5x100 leaving on 2:00 coming in at 1:23-1:25, 5x100 leaving on 1:45 coming in at 1:23-1:25, 10x50 leaving on 1:00 coming in at :35-:40, 500c/d. That seems to cook my system pretty well.

If you are going 1:05 pace for 1000, that is a hell of a lot faster than a lot of people. That would proably be top 3 out of the water if not 1st in just about any race.

It seems like your swimming is solid, what do your bike and run splits look like?

sparknote_s's picture
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sparknote_s posted 2 years ago.

That would be my goal 1000 pace when I'm in shape...right now the pace is slower. I've only started swimming (since august) 2 weeks ago so I'm still pretty out of whack.

My bike and run splits are another story heh...

For biking a very hard 20 mile ride lands me at just under 20 mph (flat and low wind).

For running a good hard long run is 45 or 50 minutes at an 8:30 / mi pace.

glbrum's picture
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glbrum posted 2 years ago.

That's not too bad. Your swimming is definitely better than your bike and run, but swimming's also the hardest to improve. I train at 17-18mph but race quite a bit faster than that. 23+ for OLY. Don't take your training speed too seriously. If you have a good base, than you could work on speed stuff.
My run pace in training is similar to yours, actually probably a bit slower than yours. But my race pace is about 6:50/mile for OLY.
I think adrenaline and a race setting have a lot to do with performance. I'm really competitive, so I push myself a lot to go fast.

sparknote_s's picture
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sparknote_s posted 2 years ago.

Well this weekend will be my first race of the season. It's really short, but thats ok I guess since it's my first tri since 2004.

400 meter swim, 12.9 mile bike, and 2.5 mile run

So I'll have to see what I can pull off.

By the way, those are some nice bike and run times you have!

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cjl posted 2 years ago.

Great Info

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glbrum posted 2 years ago.

Oh thanks. The bike was a guess as my first oly for this year is in 3 weeks. Hopefully I am as fast as my ego thinks I am....

Good luck this weekend

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catwood posted 2 years ago.

If you can come in on the 1:15 and your bike and run splits aren't so good, your time is probably better spent on the bike and run. I assume you come from a swimming background too? You sound like you are about my speed maybe a little faster. I just swim 1-4000 per week now. I quit swimming competitively after I graduated high school in 04 and now I swim about 2000 once every 1-2 weeks on average for the year. My race pace is about 1:15-1:20 now and I've been doing about 2000 2x/week for the past month. I supposed I could swim 15 hours per week like I used to and make it 1:05-1:10, but that would save me a grand total of 2.5 minutes for an olympic distance swim for 14 extra hours of swimming per week. Definitely not worth it. I'd just be an overtrained mess if I tried that especially with swimming and biking. Averaging about 12 hours of training per week with 11 of them biking and running, I can cut 10 min off the bike and 5 off the run, at least. My swimming hasn't slowed down THAT much and I'm just not worrying about it. Even if I did speed it up again, my splits probably wouldn't be that much faster because I'm pretty bad at sighting and I don't practice it so I swim off course all the time anyways.

I'm not saying I do it totally right, because I know I don't. Swimming 2-3x per week min is what you need to keep up a good feel for the water. It depends on what your personal goals are - if you want to win the swim at every race you do, go for it though. Otherwise, at least run or bike to your pool everytime you swim so you get some more training in those sports.

Take a look at the splits for your next race and look at the people that finished with similar times to you. There you will really see what you need to work on the most.

I usually do some or all of the master's workout that is still written on the whiteboard when I get to the pool. If its not there then I'll pick a workout out of http://www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/swim-cgi/ out of the mid-distance or distance freestyle workouts
or http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1931382204/002-3807499-6166427?v=glance&n=283155 ... Sometimes I'll even do a breaststroke or im set that I remember from school for fun (except I can't make that 12x 200 im set on 2:45 anymore :-( ) I can't remember what the freestylers did in school, but now I wish I could.

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sparknote_s posted 2 years ago.

Good stuff catwood. I've been thinking about dropping the swim to 2x per week, and getting an extra day of running. Currently I get in 5 bike workouts, 4 run workouts, and 3 swim workouts per week. I could probably switch the swim out for another bike or run day. I'll have to see which needs more work after I race this weekend.

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glbrum posted 2 years ago.

What types of workouts are you doing for your bike and run? Adding some specificity to those workouts could/ will make a HUGE difference. What does one of your weeks look like, maybe last week? lay out what you did in each of your bike and run workouts and I'm sure there's something we can do to add some speed. Also, what distance races are you doing?

sparknote_s's picture
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sparknote_s posted 2 years ago.

Well this week I have done/am plannging on:

Monday - Long run 45:00 (8:30 mi pace), 3,000 yard endurance swim broken up

Tuesday - Long bike 40 mi (easy at 17 mph pace), 30 minute run shortly after (8:15 pace)

Wednesday - Easy bike (25 mi or so), 3,000 yard endurance swim

Thursday - Long bike (40 mi), long run 45:00

Friday - Easy bike, swim endurance workout

Sat. - Long bike 40 mi, easy run 30:00

But actually Saturday will be a race: 400 meter swim, 12.9 mi bike, 2.5 mi run

I am thinking I should add some speed type work into running and biking. What do you think?

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AaronK posted 2 years ago.

I'm fortunate enough to have swimming year around since I was 9 through college. I had my first sprint a few months ago. I will go ahead and tell you to only worry about swimming once a week for maybe an hour. I do a lot of technique drills and lots of 150s drillswimdrill.

Train a lot more on the bike and run. The swim goes by so fast to even worry about it. I treat the swim on raceday as a warmup for the bike and run. I nice easy 3:45 .

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glbrum posted 2 years ago.

Preface: This is really long.......
Well, you ride a lot. That's good. You need an actual long run. A 45 minute run at 8:30 pace is <6miles. For a sprint that is fine, but if you want to improve you need to be running longer than that. You should be gradually increasing to atleast 1 hour. 1:15 wouldn't be bad either. I have a tendency to go by mileage, but I got up to 11 miles before my 1st Oly. It really helped. Do this run on Sunday. You don't do anything on that day. Unless you are completely shot from the week's workouts, you should do something on this day. If you can find a group to ride with once a week (most likely Sat. that WILL make a HUGE difference) than do it. It helped me improve leaps and bounds. Since you are a great swimmer you don't need to swim a bunch, that is helpful. Here's the schedule I would have If I was in your position:

MON - 3,000 yd swim (Optional)

TUES - bike: hilly ride or hill repeats
transition run

WED - 3,000 yd swim,
run: 45min. hilly route or hill repeats

THURS - bike: 3x 5-10 min. Big gear
transition run

FRI - 3,000 yd swim,
run: 45 min. tempo with middle 20-25 minutes at 10k pace

SAT - group ride (if possible) 30-50 miles,
transition run

SUN - long run (build to 10+/- miles)

If I were 100% healthy this would be my almost exact schedule (days moved around) I do the rides outlined here and the swims too. Both have helped SO MUCH. As you are a swimmer, you really only need to swim once a week, more only if you want to. Work up SLOWLY on the rest of the stuff. If you went out next week and did this schedule you'd probably come back tired/sore/injured and overtrained. For the runs maybe do 1-3 repeats on a hill that's a 1/4 mile long. The tempo can start out at like 10 minutes. Remember, this stuff will help, but you have to be healthy and willing (not overtrained) to do them. From where you are, to improve, you are going to have to really stress your system, which means these workouts hurt. The transition runs should only be like 15 minutes. Just enough to get your running legs after you get off the bike. After that it's just a run on tired bike legs. PLease make sure you have a solid base before you start doing these workouts. As fun as they are, if you don't have a strong base to build off of, they won't do you a lot of good.