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10 days to my first IM and hurt my ankle!!

kscel's picture
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started by kscel on April 9, 2009

Thoughts on this? I've trained for 5 months for IM China to be my first ever IM and just Sunday I hurt my ankle pretty bad. Can't run at all. Went to the doc and trying to rule out a stress fracture, most likely its the tendon that runs right up the innner ankle, sort of behind the large bump of the ankle bone, towards the heal, sorry I can't describe it better.

I can bike and obviously swim. I can also walk ok, but running kills. Any thoughts? Cortisone an option here? Thoughts on this as a treatment?

Not doing the race would kill me, I've been so excited for this. Further note, I'm 26 and not about to hurt myself permanantly. Running is my best leg, I run a marathon around 2.30 when fresh.

Any thoughts appreciated.

beads1985's picture
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beads1985 posted 32 weeks ago.

If you are not going to be able to run in 10 days I would consider seeing if you can defer your race and defer your plane ticket and other travel arrangements.

If not you can go an walk the marathon part.

'Nothing to it, but to do it!'

tri-ac's picture
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tri-ac posted 32 weeks ago.

wow that sucks!
only advice: lots of rest/ice and listen to your doc

TriSooner's picture
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TriSooner posted 32 weeks ago.

Swim and ride, no running. Suck it up come race day. I can't imagine putting in 5 months of IM training (not to mention to expense of travel to China) to not at least walk the marathon.

Anton's picture
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Anton posted 32 weeks ago.

Sorry for your situation...
Only the Doc can tell you if Cortisone shot is possible.
You won't lose any fitness between now and then, so my council would be to rest,Ice, compression and elevation.
Beads is wise and has some good thoughts on a deferment but being WTC, I doubt it. If they did it for you they would have to do it for everyone who banged themselves up after the drop out date. Worth a try though.
Smart to consider your age and wanting to be active the rest of your life...if you do the wrong thing and suffer even worse damage, well...that's it.
Sometimes the best lessons in life come when we ARE NOT able to do something.
How did it happen?

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rhane's picture
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rhane posted 32 weeks ago.

I'm really sorry to hear that. An anesthesiologist would be able to go through your options with you (injections) - but those are usually for chronic and persistent long-term pain. Of course, pro athletes get this done prior to big games so if you really want to compete, then you could get this done by a sports doc or anesthesiologist. I'm not sure I'd do this though...

My advice to you would be rest, ice, and compression until the race - 3x a day for 30-45 minutes each session. In addition, it its a tendon injury, compression on that area during the race may help you complete the marathon. Prewrap, a stretchy compression bandage such as Nexcare Self-Adhering Wrap, and then a compression sock over that may do the trick to keep the pain away for long enough to complete the run. This would be a temporary fix to apply after bike, but may work. Try it out to see if the wrap helps.

kscel's picture
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kscel posted 32 weeks ago.

That's the thing, I don't know how it came about, I was just running as usual and it started to hurt.

I'm right now in the camp of walking the marathon, highly doubt I can defer all my arrangements at this point and the only reason I was doing this race so far away is that I'll be over there for work anyway.

I'm planning to do the bike in under 5.30 if healthy and the swim in 1.10, so I can basically crawl the marathon and still finish, but its going to be mentally devastating to not be able to run it, especially since thats where I'm best.

I've heard advice all over the spectrum on cortisone, not sure about it yet

beads1985's picture
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beads1985 posted 32 weeks ago.

I admit, the deferment may be a long shot but you never know.

The expense of an IM, especially one with international travel is something you just don't want to not show up for.

If you can't defer see what your Dr. says.

Maybe 10 days of R.I.C.E will do the trick.

Swim and bike fast and give yourself plenty of time to take it easy thru the marathon.

Good Luck! ;-)

'Nothing to it, but to do it!'

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brittda posted 32 weeks ago.

kscel wrote:
That's the thing, I don't know how it came about, I was just running as usual and it started to hurt.

I'm right now in the camp of walking the marathon, highly doubt I can defer all my arrangements at this point and the only reason I was doing this race so far away is that I'll be over there for work anyway.

I'm planning to do the bike in under 5.30 if healthy and the swim in 1.10, so I can basically crawl the marathon and still finish, but its going to be mentally devastating to not be able to run it, especially since thats where I'm best.

I've heard advice all over the spectrum on cortisone, not sure about it yet

Well the odds of getting a partial refund or defering your entry are not good, although it does not hurt to ask.
Personally I would do the swim, bike as best as possible and walk the run if need be. Heck a good walk can get you in quickly, albeit not what you originally planned but thats o.k. Like Trisooner, I can't imagine putting in all that time and not doing the race.

amorelli's picture
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amorelli posted 32 weeks ago.

I'd definitely suggest some sort of ankle wrap - in shorter distances I've had plenty of experience and success with a good tape job, but I doubt that would hold up over a marathon distance. Some sort of supportive, compressing bandage perhaps? Or even a brace? I've seen plenty of ankle braces used in ~10k distances, so I imagine they'd last longer.

Best of luck and a speedy recovery,
Anthony

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kylie posted 32 weeks ago.

Nothing to add to your advice above but to say I hope it holds up for you on race day, best of luck, and have fun with your first IM :)

Miles of Life --- Powered by MarkyV

Anton's picture
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Anton posted 32 weeks ago.

Cho-Pat makes a great soft ankle brace that I used in my last two ultras after spraining my ankle at the JFK 50 miler. Neoprene bootie and velcro strap.
Just go walk it with running breaks if you can. If Desiree Ficker can walk an IM marathon in 7:09 (IMLP 2005) you can do it!
I guess now, you get to see what kind of Iron your made of.

"If e wishes to sweem in dangerous waters, oo are we to deny im?
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Jeff Davis posted 32 weeks ago.

The opportunity to travel to China trumps IM in my book. Travel to another country, especially one as diverse and complex as China is a lifetime opportunity to gain insight, understanding, and perspective. There will be many opportunities to participate in an IM; trips to China not so much so. Sorry to hear about the injury, but my advice is pause and consider the greater perspective.

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Ironmom posted 32 weeks ago.

So even before your first IM, you've learned the first rule of IMs - anything can happen!

I hope you can find a way to complete your IM, maybe with combination of a good wrap, walking and running if you can manage it. I've attempted two IMs and the first one I had to drop out the week before the race so I know first-hand it is emotionally wrenching to do so, especially after all that training! The 2nd one, I had a foot injury occur in the swim (of all places) and did the bike and run with a dislocated big toe, so I also know how hard it is to gut through the run with a lot of pain and injury. But, I finished it and actually had a great time, so I know it can be done. Ironman is a lot of training and one long day so I'm sure many folks have been in similar situations with something unplanned happening and trying to make the best of it.

Best of luck to you, whatever you decide to do! And remember that if for some reason you can't complete it this time, it doesn't have to be your last. You are young and can come back to tri again another day.

Blue Skies, -Robin-
http://ironmom.blogspot.com/

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firegirl posted 32 weeks ago.

sounds like your posterior tib tendon; fairly common affliction; if you are not being seen by an orthopaedic surgeon specializing in foot and ankle or sports, i would get evaluated by one. clarification regarding injections: anesthesiologists often inject spine and trigger points; interventional radiologists can do back and joints that are difficult to hit clinically because they use imaging to hit dead-on; as far as tendons go, i strongly recommend an orthopaedist evals you and then injects or refers to someone for injection. that said, cortisone injection is associated with a risk of tendon rupture; one injection may not do it, but as a 26yo potential ironman, i heartily agree with above posters that if you must compete, walk the marathon. bracing or arch support may give you some relief as well. regardless, its a hard position to be in and i wish you luck; congrats on the stellar training you've done to be here.

kscel's picture
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kscel posted 32 weeks ago.

thanks for all this guys, i think i'm leaning towards the walking / taking it really easy on the marathon portion, racing in China is only half "race" anyway, as much an adventure & cool experience.

firegirl - if i had a cortisone shot just to keep the pain away, my odds of tendon rupture are pretty slim I assume? I realize i shouldn't dismiss the potential risks even if so, but just to get through it? i don't want to do anything stupid here, but REALLY want to do this

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firegirl posted 32 weeks ago.

yes, the odds are slim; rupture appears to be associated with injection directly into the tendon (as opposed to within the tendon sheath but outside the tendon itself) which is why i recommend a foot/ankle or sports guy sees you. there isn't any good literature on the incidence in the posterior tib, but other weight-bearing tendons (achilles and patellar) have shown increased incidence of rupture; this is multifactorial, so hard to apply as a hard and fast rule. additiionally, the current recommendation is to delay strenuous activity for 2wks after injection of a weight-bearing tendon to decrease risk of rupture. however, you should be able to find a surgeon who will inject you if thats what you really want. the caveat is: rupture in an athlete is a surgical problem that will take you out for months.
basically, you need to talk to an orthopod you trust who is used to treating these disorders and has done this injection before. intratendinous injection is more likely to occur with someone who doesn't do this much.
best of luck.
fg

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Gsal posted 32 weeks ago.

everyone's comments are good. Again, just ice and use some of this time to taper and take it easy. If your such a strong runner, definitely dont do any running 10 days before so you have time to heal your injury. You shouldnt have to worry too much about losing too much fitness by just biking and running. Maybe your marathon time will suffer a little bit, but its better to lose some time rather than drop out of the race entirely or not even be able to start the race. ITs too bad that this happened, but it does happen, so dont kill yourself if come race day you have to drop out. But i definitely wouldnt recommend running right now.

"You can never be too rich or too skinny."
-My doctor

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rhane posted 32 weeks ago.

firegirl, would compression temporarily help the posterior tibial tendon injury if it's just tendonitis - i.e. in order to jog the marathon? When you say these types of problems are common in runners, for example, what exactly is the injury you are referring to - posterior tibial tendonitis, dysfunctional posterior tibial tendon, partial tear of the PTT? If it's a partial tear, then an injection isn't going to help very much will it? Imaging is needed to decipher the best route here, correct - CAT?

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firegirl posted 32 weeks ago.

i'll answer your questions in order.
1. yes, simply tendonitis may be aided with compression to jog a marathon; arch support may help as well, but difficult to say exactly without examining.
2. tendonitis is common in runners; ptt dysfunction is more common in sedentary people, but either may occur in people with flat feet; attritional tears are likely in longstanding conditions; acute rupture is not terribly common.
3. a partial tear can be helped with injection in a very temporary situation (like this one) as it helps to cause the inflammation that likely lead to the tear, and is usually a large component of the pain generator. as we discussed before, though, injection can increase the risk of rupture and in a tendon that is already weakened, this is a pretty big chance to take.
4. physical exam by a qualified surgeon will give you 90% of the diagnosis, but you are right on the money that further imaging would give you the most bang for your buck; MRI would show whether the tendon is intact, inflamed, partially torn, etc.
nutshell-- if it was my foot, i'd tape/compress/support the crap out of it and jog-walk with the NSAID of your choice on board (aleve, ibuprofen, celebrex, etc); but i would not inject; if OP isn't planning on winning this IM, rec getting the experience and coming back healthy next year.

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Anton posted 32 weeks ago.

Oh, God...medical folks. ;)
Doctors? Nurses? Med students? Fans of Grey's Anatomy?

"If e wishes to sweem in dangerous waters, oo are we to deny im?
-Chef Skinner
http://antonspath.blogspot.com

firegirl's picture
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firegirl posted 32 weeks ago.

i prefer 'scrubs.'

ortho md.

will keep medical prosyletizing to a minimum :-)

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Ironmom posted 32 weeks ago.

firegirl wrote:

nutshell-- if it was my foot, i'd tape/compress/support the crap out of it and jog-walk with the NSAID of your choice on board (aleve, ibuprofen, celebrex, etc); but i would not inject; if OP isn't planning on winning this IM, rec getting the experience and coming back healthy next year.

Not a medical professional here, but I'll note that taking NSAIDs during an Ironman can be a dicey proposition. Especially in the volumes required, depending of course on how your stomach normally does on them. I found that after awhile they made me vomit up anything and everything (nutrition, fluids) which I have never done before. It was not a good thing with 3 hours to go in the race. I think there are other issues with them concerning liver, hydration, etc. in a race of this intensity & length (I believe there was a thread on that somewhere around a year ago).

Blue Skies, -Robin-
http://ironmom.blogspot.com/

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Gsal posted 32 weeks ago.

firegirl wrote:
i prefer 'scrubs.'

+1 scrubs is the bestest

"You can never be too rich or too skinny."
-My doctor

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tri-ac posted 32 weeks ago.

firegirl wrote:
i prefer 'scrubs.'

ortho md.

will keep medical prosyletizing to a minimum :-)

we're always diagnosing online...now we have someone to keep us honest :)

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firegirl posted 32 weeks ago.

general medicolegal disclaimer: nothing i say should substitute for seeing your doctor. :-)

clarification:
- nsaids before & after, not during; scheduled for 3-5days prior to the race can really help with inflammation and pain and will not affect renal function in pts without renal disease; i'm not sure what you mean by "in the volumes required" but you shouldn't be taking more than the recommended doses unless you are actively followed by a doctor who recommends this (rx doses of ibuprofen are 800mg 3x/day, aleve/naproxen 500mg 2x/day)
-anti-inflammatories can affect renal function, and hydration is definitely key; a seasoned triathlete or someone followed by a sports md/trainer, etc may be able to achieve the necessary hydration and nutrition balance to take meds during the race, but for anyone else i would not take the chance.
-ironmom had an excellent point that most nsaids can cause GI upset, so i wouldn't take anything new before a race; they should also be taken with food. the amount of food most athletes take in during a race is probably not adequate to protect your stomach, but you have to know your body.
cheers.
fg

kscel's picture
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kscel posted 19 weeks ago.

I received a message asking what happened here. Its a really long story, I did get to IM china and I made it about 120-130 miles before collapsing in the 110+ degree heat. Woke up in a hospital in China w/ 4 IVs, was pretty crazy. basically i ran out of salt, pretty dangerous i now know. IM Kentucky in August for try #2! So basically although the ankle hurt it didn't really matter as i wasn't really "running" by the time i got to the marathon, i was hurting way too much

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jtrimom posted 19 weeks ago.

wow! sorry to hear that. Kentucky should be pretty warm too

Taper Naked

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prendergi posted 19 weeks ago.

I remember reading some stories about China and that it was BRUTAL!! Super humid, super hot - so hot that the aid stations had warm/hot water nothing cold! Talk about a war story! Good luck in Kentucky!

"The pain of discipline is far less than the pain of regret" - Sarah Bombell