ice bath
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zagfan posted 44 weeks ago.
I used them last summer and would just come home after my long rides/runs and take the whole ice dispenser out of the freezer and march on up to my bathtub. I would fill the tub up to my waist (sitting down of course) with just cold tap water. Once my body adapted to the cold I would then dump all of the ice into the tub and enjoy the numbing pain for about 10-15 minutes. I would then actually jump right into a hot shower. I've read that the ice bath helps draws the blood out of your legs and the hot shower then helps pump fresh blood back down. Not sure if its true, all I know is that I felt refreshed afterwards so even if it is a little silly I'll continue doing it. But not in the winter of course b/c that would be a little nuts...pun intended :) (I couldn't resist)
"Pain is temporary. Quitting lasts forever." Lance Armstrong
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J.Michael posted 44 weeks ago.
I do the last 1/2 mile of my long workout carrying the ice home. Take it up stairs and drop it in the tub. Add enough water to make it all float and cover my lower body.
Then, I stretch out for about 15-20 mins while the ice is getting the water down to temp. When I'm stretched it's up to the bath. Most of the time I leave my tri/bike shorts on as it helps with the initial shock factor a bit. I usually wear a long sleeve shirt, grab a book or sailing magazine and sit for 10-20 mins. A lot of the time I take a post workout meal/snack up to the tub with me, as I can be near the end of the glycogen window depending on how long I stretch.
After, I'm all soaked out, I grab some clothes for after my shower, maybe play guitar for a few to just chill out, log my workout on Trifuel, and hop in the shower.
“Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.”
— Winston Churchill
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mtbke15 posted 44 weeks ago.
After my long runs during the summer and fall, I would take the bucket of ice and drop it in with the cold tap water. Sit there for about 10-15 minutes while reading something. I don't wear anything on my upper body and just brave the cold. Afterward I just take a hot shower slowly making the shower warmer so not to shock my body too much. It seems to help my legs recover faster and feel less sore during the rest of the day. Having shin splints and needing to ice them anyway an ice bath kills two birds with one stone.
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lala2021 posted 44 weeks ago.
I do this after a long run or ride during the warmer months. I usually skip the ice cause we have well water thats really cold!I like to take a warm shower asap cause i freeze! brrr!
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Gsal posted 44 weeks ago.
i take about 2 a week in the winter and maybe 4 during the summer. I don't use the hot shower technique though. I just fill it up really cold, then put two 8 lb ice bags in (its a little excessive--> most use 1). Stay in for 12 minutes with some tea but nothing on my upper or lower body. i also listen to intense music and read inside tri or triathlete mag to remember why im putting myself through so much pain haha
"You can never be too rich or too skinny."
-My doctor
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TriSooner posted 44 weeks ago.
advobwhite wrote:
put ice in . . . cover up your upper body to keep it warm, and take a 10 min soak . . . drink a beer or two . . . then get out and eat your post workout meal . . . thenabout 30-60 mins later,right after, take a hot shower and then a nap.
Italics I added, but yes, yes, and yes, and only needed after long runs (20+) and long bikes (5hrs+).
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kylie posted 44 weeks ago.
Just some random tips on it I got from a PT:
- You shouldn't just jump right in: cooldown first, clear the lactic, etc. Then ice
- By icing you limit the amount of damage caused by the lactate/lack of oxygen/lack of nutrients after a workout
- A warm shower right after the ice bath will reduce the effects of the ice bath (although muscle tissue temperature does return to normal in about 15 min)
- So say you have a 40 min tempo run. Walk/easy jog for 10-15 min and then an ice bath for the best recovery profile
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beads1985 posted 44 weeks ago.
kylie wrote:
Just some random tips on it I got from a PT:
- You shouldn't just jump right in: cooldown first, clear the lactic, etc. Then ice
- By icing you limit the amount of damage caused by the lactate/lack of oxygen/lack of nutrients after a workout
- A warm shower right after the ice bath will reduce the effects of the ice bath (although muscle tissue temperature does return to normal in about 15 min)
- So say you have a 40 min tempo run. Walk/easy jog for 10-15 min and then an ice bath for the best recovery profile
I don't usually do an ice bath for anything under 2 hours.
I do the cool down and eat my recovery food and that is about it.
'Nothing to it, but to do it!'
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kylie posted 44 weeks ago.
I sometimes crave them for shorter stuff - depends how hard I went! There is distance breakdown feeling, but also the intensity breakdown feeling.
Not that I often do ice baths... they take too much effort and I'm lazy.
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Gsal posted 44 weeks ago.
i'll do ice baths after a hard workout (intervals on the bike, tempo/speed workout running) OR my long runs. You dont have to go long to take an ice bath. If you feel sore after a workout you can take one. I wouldnt say that there is a set limit on when you shoudl take em. if you feel crappy, hop in!
"You can never be too rich or too skinny."
-My doctor
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advobwhite posted 44 weeks ago.
i took the plunge today....my lower extremeties feel soooo much better. i'll see how i feel in the AM. if all goes well it'll probly become a nightly/every other night thing...as much stuff as i do, i'll welcome all recovery aids.
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littleironhead posted 44 weeks ago.
My whole cross country team took them about once a week during the season. We have a big ice machine and some metal tubs next to the weight room at our high school. It definitely helped to ease soreness and speed up recovery but I've heard you shouldn't take a shower or anything for at least two hours after
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littleironhead posted 44 weeks ago.
oh, and I think we got it down to like 50 sometimes, but that's pretty cold. And I've also heard the max you are supposed to stay in is 20 minutes
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jtrimom posted 44 weeks ago.
would it work if I just stepped into my pool after the marathon? The lows are in the 40s, highs in the 60s...OOHHHHH, please don't let it rain!
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Star posted 44 weeks ago.
I didn't see this post before posting my own thread about the ice bath. Check it out in the Health/Nutrition section :)
"I'm more fun than an iPod!"
My blog:http://starsnextbigthing.blogspot.com/
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tri-ac posted 44 weeks ago.
jtrimom wrote:
would it work if I just stepped into my pool after the marathon?
yes, it's helpful
but the colder water, the better the result
i've also heard from a PT that doing a minute of totally cold in the shower then back to hot works as well...this works best if you have a handheld-type shower, otherwise there's not much focus to the water on the muscles.
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jtrimom posted 44 weeks ago.
tri-ac wrote:
jtrimom wrote:would it work if I just stepped into my pool after the marathon?yes, it's helpful
but the colder water, the better the resulti've also heard from a PT that doing a minute of totally cold in the shower then back to hot works as well...this works best if you have a handheld-type shower, otherwise there's not much focus to the water on the muscles.
you don't think that a 40 degree low should make the water cold enough? I am asking b/c I need to know if I should stop by the store and pick up a couple bags of ice on the way home...what is the "ideal" temp of an ice bath?
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tri-ac posted 44 weeks ago.
jtrimom wrote:
tri-ac wrote:jtrimom wrote:would it work if I just stepped into my pool after the marathon?yes, it's helpful
but the colder water, the better the resulti've also heard from a PT that doing a minute of totally cold in the shower then back to hot works as well...this works best if you have a handheld-type shower, otherwise there's not much focus to the water on the muscles.
you don't think that a 40 degree low should make the water cold enough? I am asking b/c I need to know if I should stop by the store and pick up a couple bags of ice on the way home...what is the "ideal" temp of an ice bath?
ice is definitely better
i've never stuck a thermometer in the water...but I use 4 bags: fill the tub with cold water to submerge the legs, hop in, THEN add the ice. I tried 2, then 3 bags, but 4 seemed to have the best results (ie not totally melting away in 5 secs)
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jtrimom posted 44 weeks ago.
tri-ac wrote:
jtrimom wrote:tri-ac wrote:jtrimom wrote:would it work if I just stepped into my pool after the marathon?yes, it's helpful
but the colder water, the better the resulti've also heard from a PT that doing a minute of totally cold in the shower then back to hot works as well...this works best if you have a handheld-type shower, otherwise there's not much focus to the water on the muscles.
you don't think that a 40 degree low should make the water cold enough? I am asking b/c I need to know if I should stop by the store and pick up a couple bags of ice on the way home...what is the "ideal" temp of an ice bath?
ice is definitely better
i've never stuck a thermometer in the water...but I use 4 bags: fill the tub with cold water to submerge the legs, hop in, THEN add the ice. I tried 2, then 3 bags, but 4 seemed to have the best results (ie not totally melting away in 5 secs)
thanks, that sounds absoultely...miserable, but I guess I'll have to join the club
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SerialKiller posted 44 weeks ago.
just so you no, in order to get frost bite your skin has to freeze, less than 32*f so while hypothermia might set in there is no danger of frost bite unless the tub is a solid chunk of ice.
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stewarba posted 44 weeks ago.
I don't buy into the ice bath hype - I have never seen any scientific studies that support the alleged benefits.
Pain is the sensation of weakness leaving the body!
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J.Michael posted 44 weeks ago.
stewarba wrote:
I don't buy into the ice bath hype - I have never seen any scientific studies that support the alleged benefits.
I've never seen any scientific study on the fact that when I wring out a sponge that the water that I squeezed out was actually removed. I have, however, rung out a sponge in person and from my personal experience have gained the knowledge that the water indeed does squeeze out of the sponge.
When you have lactic acid built up in your lower extremities, and has been scientifically linked with soreness and muscle atrophy. Now your blood is more saturated with the acid and no longer pumping as fast through your body due to cessation of strenuous activity. The longer we leave the lactic acid in the blood to break down muscle fibers, the more damage it can cause.
Now, let's suppose there is a way to constrict blood vessels and capillaries effectively squeezing the blood therein contained to other parts of the body. Thus, spreading out the effects of lactic acid throughout the body and not localizing it to just the lower extremities. We have then reduced the amount of time that the acid has to affect the already fatigued muscles.
Sounds.....like a bunch of voodoo hoopla to me too!
I guess all of us are experiencing a placebo?
“Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.”
— Winston Churchill
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Gsal posted 44 weeks ago.
J.Michael wrote:
Sounds.....like a bunch of voodoo hoopla to me too!
I guess all of us are experiencing a placebo?
+ 1....I doubt that so many elite AND amateur athletes would utilize this technique if it didnt really work.
"You can never be too rich or too skinny."
-My doctor
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SerialKiller posted 44 weeks ago.
while i have seen a scientific thangy, it wasn't a study becouse it wasn't big enough (only like 3 people) (it was a little side coluom in scientific america) but it showed the most benifit comes from ice bath which cut blood flow to iced areas, which doesn't get rid of the acid or spread it around, it forces it to sit where it is it does lower your motablism, which effectivly halts any more damage. then taking a hot shower which expans the amount of blood flowing and "washes" the "toxins" away
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J.Michael posted 44 weeks ago.
SerialKiller wrote:
while i have seen a scientific thangy, it wasn't a study becouse it wasn't big enough (only like 3 people) (it was a little side coluom in scientific america) but it showed the most benifit comes from ice bath which cut blood flow to iced areas, which doesn't get rid of the acid or spread it around, it forces it to sit where it is it does lower your motablism, which effectivly halts any more damage. then taking a hot shower which expans the amount of blood flowing and "washes" the "toxins" away
I knew a guy that was a sports massage therapist with the Indianapolis Colts. He worked with them a lot in training camp, and throughout the season. I was just getting into cycling long distances before he moved out to CA for a new position. Anyways, he told me similar to what you've said. That when you shower afterwards, it helps flush everything out of the legs. But, he also said that when you're extremities are being iced the vessels will contract and it does force the blood already in veins and arteries into other areas of the body. It's kind of like squeezing a straw filled with liquid. That liquid you displace by decreasing volume has to go somewhere. Now if you have a blockage, the intravenular pressure will rise and that can actually be dangerous (albiet, quite rare in athletes) for those prone to excessive clotting or those with vessels already constricted by Atherosclerosis. (I doubt you'll see many trifuelers with Atherosclerosis)
Nonetheless, ice baths will cause the lactic acid in you legs to dissipate to other areas of the body. Once you shower, the lactic acid doesn't disappear. It gets metabolized by the rest of the body.
“Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.”
— Winston Churchill
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tri-ac posted 44 weeks ago.
i had the most wonderful sleep once...it occurred after an evening spent in a sauna in finland
10mins in the sauna
5mins snow angels on the frozen lake
10mins in the sauna
etc
i don't remember how many times we repeated it
then a little sexy fun time with the then-girlfriend, now wife
and then the best nights sleep EVER! (EVER!)
i'm convinced the hot/cold treatment tenderized my whole body...it was awesome!
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J.Michael posted 44 weeks ago.
tri-ac wrote:
then a little sexy fun time
"You makea da sexy time?.......how much?....."
//obscure?
“Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.”
— Winston Churchill
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mtbke15 posted 44 weeks ago.
Here is a study (the abstract only because I could not get the full article) by the British Journal of Sports Medicine. Even though it disputes that ice-baths work, if it makes my legs feel better I'm going to stick with it despite what a study says.
ice-water immersion and delayed-onset muscle soreness: a randomised controlled trial
Kylie Louise Sellwood1, Peter Brukner2, David Williams2, Alastair Nicol2, Rana Hinman2
1 Sports Physicians ACT, Deakin, Australia
2 University of Melbourne, Melbourne, Victoria, Australia
Objective: To determine if ice-water immersion after eccentric quadriceps exercise minimises the symptoms of delayed-onset muscle soreness (DOMS).
Design: A prospective randomised double-blind controlled trial was undertaken. 40 untrained volunteers performed an eccentric loading protocol with their non-dominant leg.
Interventions: Participants were randomised to three 1-min immersions in either ice water (5±1°C) or tepid water (24°C).
Main outcome measures: Pain and tenderness (visual analogue scale), swelling (thigh circumference), function (one-legged hop for distance), maximal isometric strength and serum creatine kinase (CK) recorded at baseline, 24, 48 and 72 h after exercise. Changes in outcome measures over time were compared to determine the effect of group allocation using independent t tests or Mann–Whitney U tests.
Results: No significant differences were observed between groups with regard to changes in most pain parameters, tenderness, isometric strength, swelling, hop-for-distance or serum CK over time. There was a significant difference in pain on sit-to-stand at 24 h, with the intervention group demonstrating a greater increase in pain than the control group (median change 8.0 vs 2.0 mm, respectively, p = 0.009).
Conclusions: The protocol of ice-water immersion used in this study was ineffectual in minimising markers of DOMS in untrained individuals. This study challenges the wide use of this intervention as a recovery strategy by athletes.
Abbreviations: CK, creatine kinase; DOMS, delayed-onset muscle soreness; VAS, visual analogue scale
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tri-ac posted 44 weeks ago.
(3) 1:00 immersions @ 5°C?
i'd agree that wouldn't be effective
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kylie posted 44 weeks ago.
mtbke15 wrote:
ice-water immersion and delayed-onset muscle soreness: a randomised controlled trial
Kylie Louise Sellwood1, Peter Brukner2, David Williams2, Alastair Nicol2, Rana Hinman2
I didn't do it.
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J.Michael posted 44 weeks ago.
tri-ac wrote:
(3) 1:00 immersions @ 5°C?
i'd agree that wouldn't be effective
That's what I thought!.....I guess it'd be about as effective as 3 - 1min workouts?
That's like studying the benefits of long distance running by having people walk out to get their newspaper on the front lawn!
“Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.”
— Winston Churchill
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mtbke15 posted 44 weeks ago.
I agree, it was merely to show that there are studies out there and this one took 5 minutes and the first one I found. So, if someone really wanted scientific proof its out there.
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J.Michael posted 44 weeks ago.
Well, if anyone wants the science of what others and myself have seen to be true. Let's do some googling.....
Rugby Players @ bbc.co.uk
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sportacademy/hi/sa/treatment_room/features/newsid_...
Article on Hydrotherapy
http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/hydrotherapy.html
Could This Be The New RICE? Space Legs?
http://www.slipstreamsports.com/2008/07/11/our-secret-recovery-weapon
“Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.”
— Winston Churchill
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beads1985 posted 44 weeks ago.
Well considering R.I.C.E is based on scientific facts, and the 'I' stands for 'Ice'.
I would venture to say that 'Ice' baths are a scientifically proven way to reduce swelling and inflammation.
Since you have swelling and inflammation in you legs from running and cycling, an 'Ice' bath seems like a logical conclusion. ;-)
'Nothing to it, but to do it!'
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stewarba posted 44 weeks ago.
J.Michael wrote:
I've never seen any scientific study on the fact that when I wring out a sponge that the water that I squeezed out was actually removed. I have, however, rung out a sponge in person and from my personal experience have gained the knowledge that the water indeed does squeeze out of the sponge.
....
Sounds.....like a bunch of voodoo hoopla to me too!I guess all of us are experiencing a placebo?
whoa brother, sorry, I didn't mean to get the ice bath disciples all worked up. ;-) Its just that I can barely handle getting into a cold pool in the spring, so getting into water that actually has ice in it really doesn't sound too fun. When I tried to look up any proven evidence to support the benefits, everything I read either didn't support the benefits or was inconclusive. I was merely adding my .02 cents on the topic.
Pain is the sensation of weakness leaving the body!
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brittda posted 44 weeks ago.
stewarba wrote:
J.Michael wrote:I've never seen any scientific study on the fact that when I wring out a sponge that the water that I squeezed out was actually removed. I have, however, rung out a sponge in person and from my personal experience have gained the knowledge that the water indeed does squeeze out of the sponge.
....
Sounds.....like a bunch of voodoo hoopla to me too!I guess all of us are experiencing a placebo?
whoa brother, sorry, I didn't mean to get the ice bath disciples all worked up. ;-) Its just that I can barely handle getting into a cold pool in the spring, so getting into water that actually has ice in it really doesn't sound too fun. When I tried to look up any proven evidence to support the benefits, everything I read either didn't support the benefits or was inconclusive. I was merely adding my .02 cents on the topic.
Well, no it's not FUN, but then again neither is my weekly massage. One would think that would be relaxing, but nooooooooooooooooooo more like a torture session. But, it works. So does the ice tubby :)
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J.Michael posted 44 weeks ago.
stewarba wrote:
whoa brother, sorry, I didn't mean to get the ice bath disciples all worked up. ;-) Its just that I can barely handle getting into a cold pool in the spring, so getting into water that actually has ice in it really doesn't sound too fun. When I tried to look up any proven evidence to support the benefits, everything I read either didn't support the benefits or was inconclusive. I was merely adding my .02 cents on the topic.
I can understand how one can be uncomfortable soaking in unnaturally cold water. I was just stating that just because there is no exact study dealing with the efficacy of ice bath therapy and triathlon/long run training, does that make it less beneficial/logical. Regardless of what science can currently quantify, what has been shown to work.....work's.
There is a reason that when people hurt a muscle or joint that RICE is the 1st advice given. (Rest Ice Compression Elevation) Why do hospitals give you an ice pack? Tell you to stay off the injury? Give you an ace bandage/compression bandage? And tell you to keep it above your heart?....
Every high level locker room I've been in has steel whirlpools used mainly for ice baths.
If you've ever tried to down to the locker room to get an autograph from a football or soccer player after the game, chances are you've seen them with ice bags on their quads. If there was only a placebo effect to be had, would the most high paid benefactors, who can afford pretty much anything, use such a useless recovery tool?
The only thing I've ever been cautioned on by any sports massage therapist is to not ice for too long as this can slow down the body's natural healing process. You can avoid this by confining your sessions to 20-30 minutes maximum and stimulate blood flow by taking a nice hot shower afterward.
“Success is the ability to go from one failure to another with no loss of enthusiasm.”
— Winston Churchill
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jtrimom posted 43 weeks ago.
I took my 1st ice bath today after my marathon...in my pool- it was DEFINITELY cold enough. I don't know what I would have felt like otherwise so I can't compare, but I can walk and I am hoping for little soreness tomorrow
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i wasn't sure if this goes here or health/nutrition so i am just gonna post here.
have any of you experimented w/ ice bath? what you do is get enough in the bath tub to cover your legs, and put ice in it till its about 60'-65 degrees(might be a lil high, don't remember if its taht or a lil lower, but too low could have permanent damage ie frosbite, etc) and cover up your upper body to keep it warm, and take a 10 min soak. then get out and eat your post workout meal w/ some hot tea or coffee. then about 30-60 mins later, take a hot shower. i'm wondering if u guys have tried anything along those lines or have your own ice bath routine you do.