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Who makes the best triathlete?

longhair's picture
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started by longhair on January 27, 2008

As a cyclist turned triathlete, I tend to struggle with the swimming and running. As a result, I spend most of my time on these disciplines.

While I swim endless laps at the local pool (after getting some help with my stroke from swimmer friends), or run mile after mile to build endurance, I have plenty of time to think. I can share these thoughts another time, but one musing I had was who makes the best triathlete? Since most of us did not grow up multisport athletes, I wonder who has the best success in making the transition? Is it the swimmer whose perfect technique effortlessly gets them through the water? Is it the runner who already can run 6 minute miles? Is it the cyclist who can turn the cranks the fastest at the local TT?

Just wondering...

Sully800's picture
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Sully800 posted 36 weeks ago.

It depends on the format and length of the races, but for USAT rules I think cyclists make the best triathletes because that is always the longest leg of the event. The bike leg can sway the results more in either direction since it takes about half of the race. By the same thought, swimming is the least important because it is always the shortest leg.

The exception would be in draft legal races which greatly reduce the importance of a cycling background. A strong swim is needed to get into the bike pack, but then you can draft during the majority of the bike. The athletes are packed much closer together going into the run, so being a strong runner is key in those races. But draft-legal races are rare for age group athletes so I'll stick with cycling as being the most important leg.

tsilcyc's picture
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tsilcyc posted 36 weeks ago.

If we're talking about professionals, they need to be strong in ALL disciplines. There just isn't any room for mediocrity anymore. I saw an interview with (I think it was) Tim DeBoom before Kona. They were asking him about racing Ironman and he mentioned how you can't slack in any of the disciplines because the competition is so tough now.

AGer's, I think as long as your an "efficient" swimmer and strong at the bike and run, you're going to place high. If you're weak in biking or running, you're MOP. The competition is tough here too.

I guess to answer your question, it would be the biker or runner.

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Pete L.'s picture
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Pete L. posted 36 weeks ago.

I think you can have either. It seems like Normann Stadtler is a cyclist, and McCormack was a runner. It seems to me though that the runners have somewhat of an edge. Stadtler is extremely probably a few points beyond what we'd consider "strong on the bike."

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azstinger11 posted 36 weeks ago.

Personally I'd say a swimmer turned triathlete. IMO you can build up running and biking at very respectable rates in a much shorter period of time, swimming is all about technique. If you started swimming at a young age and had that proper form burned into you for a long time it would be much easier to gain the other two disciplines. Guess I'm in the minority on this one though.

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McTri's picture
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McTri posted 36 weeks ago.

I probably make the best Triathlete, but I will have to wait to prove that until my kids grow up.

Sully800's picture
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Sully800 posted 36 weeks ago.

One additional thought: Many triathletes have trouble with running because the impact causes them injuries (most likely due to improper form and inefficient technique). On the other hand, a life long runner is probably very efficient and will face fewer injuries when switching to triathlons.

If efficient swimming and biking lead to much faster splits but efficient running leads to an injury free season the runner might come out ahead based on training consistency.

catwood's picture
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catwood posted 36 weeks ago.

Swimmers! Ok, I'm a bit biased.

It did take me a while to get the hang of running without injury. That's really more due to my incredibly awful biomechanics that limit me to 20mpw (25 max during a run focus week). But, I use my miles wisely and can run reasonably fast. It also took a while to build strength to bike fast and I still lack a lot of strength there.

Swimmers have the advantage because they have the technique and understand the importance of training technique. A runner or cyclist is likely to approach swimming like they approach their sport - swim lots. Many of them never get it. That doesn't exactly work. If only the swim were a bit longer, we'd leave all the land animals in the dust.

However, there are some pitfalls that swimmers may encounter. Typical swim team training is all high intensity once your technique gets pretty good. Intervals Intervals Intervals. No such thing as LSD. If that approach is applied to running and cycling, overtraining is very likely. The other thing is that swimmers are particularly prone to running injury because we have no experience in weight bearing activity. The mindset that need to be applied is bike and swim for fitness, run to eventually be able to run without injury.

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tsilcyc posted 36 weeks ago.

catwood wrote:
Swimmers! Ok, I'm a bit biased.

Swimmers have the advantage because they have the technique and understand the importance of training technique. A runner or cyclist is likely to approach swimming like they approach their sport - swim lots. Many of them never get it. That doesn't exactly work. If only the swim were a bit longer, we'd leave all the land animals in the dust.

And I think the last sentence really summarizes the problem for swimmers. You can be the fastest swimmer at an IM distance race and your lead is going to be 5 minutes.

2007 Iroman Arizona: The number one swimmer was out of the water in 48:25, he finished in 53rd place. Rutger Beke was out of the water in 52:08 and finished first overall. Tim DeBoom was 49:10 and finished in second place. Tim & Rutger could've done the swim in 1.5 hours and this guy still wouldn't have come close. The guy is clearly a FAST swimmer but he's just a fast AGer.

Now, if we give him a slower swim time and give him the same bike time as Tim DeBoom, leaving his run time as is, he's finishing in 10th place. Leave his bike time as is and give him Tim DeBoom's run time and he's top 20.

Biker wins.

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Leroy Bonkers's picture
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Leroy Bonkers posted 36 weeks ago.

Per Sully and tsilcyc, the answer depends on the format.

TriSooner's picture
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TriSooner posted 36 weeks ago.

From races that I have watched and from a few pros I know, the swimmers are usually out of the water so quickly (:20 for a half IM!) they soft-peddle and jog the run. Plus, I think the mental discipline that swimers develop from HS and College swim practices at dark:30 in 0-degree winter makes them stronger.

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PrinceofClydes posted 36 weeks ago.

McTri wrote:
I probably make the best Triathlete, but I will have to wait to prove that until my kids grow up.

LOL I like your take on this question, but I think Mark Allen's Mom and Dad have the edge on you based on current results.

Good luck with your breeding program though. heh.

PoC

"Pain doesn't last, chicks dig scars, glory is forever!"
- Shane Falco.

catwood's picture
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catwood posted 36 weeks ago.

Ok, I'll amend. Short term: cyclists. Long term: swimmers. I don't really care about long distance triathlons so time gaps are more manageable.

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jhudalla posted 36 weeks ago.

For anything over an olympic distance I'd have to say the prize goes to the cyclist. In any short distance the fastest swimmer can get out of the water while barely getting wet and off to the bike before the rest of us get our shoes on. When the distance on the bike is less than 40 miles it's very difficult to reel someone back in even if you're going 2-3 mph faster on average than they are ( if they have 5 or more minutes head start on you ). On the other hand if the distance is HIM to IM, swimmers get less of the advantage and as long as the athlete comes out of the water some place mid pack they're setup for the bike/run.

bikers/runners for long courses - hilly olympic+
swimmers for short - sprint/olympic

:: don't taze me bro ::

Weary is the path that does not challenge.

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TBRAVO posted 36 weeks ago.

Hey isn’t this the same argument that started all this triathlon / Ironman mess in the first place?!?
Cyclists of course make the best triathletes…duh!
Silly swimmers / runners…

beads1985's picture
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beads1985 posted 36 weeks ago.

TBRAVO wrote:
Hey isn’t this the same argument that started all this triathlon / Ironman mess in the first place?!?
Cyclists of course make the best triathletes…duh!
Silly swimmers / runners…

Yes indeed!!

Nothing to it, but to do it

McTri's picture
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McTri posted 36 weeks ago.

PrinceofClydes wrote:
McTri wrote:
I probably make the best Triathlete, but I will have to wait to prove that until my kids grow up.

LOL I like your take on this question, but I think Mark Allen's Mom and Dad have the edge on you based on current results.

Good luck with your breeding program though. heh.

PoC

Yes, but their results are published and mine are just a hypothesis. My potential is unlimited!

PrinceofClydes's picture
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PrinceofClydes posted 36 weeks ago.

McTri wrote:
PrinceofClydes wrote:

LOL I like your take on this question, but I think Mark Allen's Mom and Dad have the edge on you based on current results.

Good luck with your breeding program though. heh.

PoC

Yes, but their results are published and mine are just a hypothesis. My potential is unlimited!

The East Germans were the first to realize the potential of steroids and hgh on Olympic swimmers, I bet they or someone else is already conducting a breeding program for triathletes etc.

Remember GoldenGirl, Susan Anton's movie?

Maybe you could get a berth as a stud?
Maybe we could syndicate you, like Seattle Slew, and make some money.
PoC

"Pain doesn't last, chicks dig scars, glory is forever!"
- Shane Falco.

beads1985's picture
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beads1985 posted 36 weeks ago.

PrinceofClydes wrote:
McTri wrote:
PrinceofClydes wrote:

LOL I like your take on this question, but I think Mark Allen's Mom and Dad have the edge on you based on current results.

Good luck with your breeding program though. heh.

PoC

Yes, but their results are published and mine are just a hypothesis. My potential is unlimited!

The East Germans were the first to realize the potential of steroids and hgh on Olympic swimmers, I bet they or someone else is already conducting a breeding program for triathletes etc.

Remember GoldenGirl, Susan Anton's movie?

Maybe you could get a berth as a stud?
Maybe we could syndicate you, like Seattle Slew, and make some money.
PoC

I certainly remember Susan Anton!!!

Nothing to it, but to do it

PrinceofClydes's picture
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PrinceofClydes posted 36 weeks ago.

Susan Anton

for those who didn't know. The premise was that she had been bred for Gold in a eugenics program. Great footage of a non-athlete looking good in hotpants, sort of Hooters meets Personal Best

cf, Mariel Hemingway

another way to interpret "longhair's" question is who would make the best triathlete from a photogenic perspective, in which case I vote for swimmers every time. I mean, compare, l-r below, Jeannie Longo - world's best female cyclist all time, Mizuko Noguchi - 2004 Gold medalist marathoner, and Dara Torres US Gold medalist swimmer(below)

Okay, sorry longhair, don't mean to hijack your thread.

PoC

"Pain doesn't last, chicks dig scars, glory is forever!"
- Shane Falco.

longhair's picture
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longhair posted 35 weeks ago.

Great stuff all around!!! You never know where a question will lead.

This is the first year I would say I have made a real committment to getting faster, stonger, better (anyone recognize the lead in to the 6 million dollar man?) My first two years was a lot of random running and swimming, and the most time was spent riding because I enjoyed it the most. This year, with the Ironman 70.3 Providence as my goal, I am followed a structured schedule for training, particularly trying to improve running endurance.

I also invested in a new bike, and aero wheels arrive in April. I am looking forward to enjoying every minute of the Providence event. Hope to see some of you there. Look for the clueless guy with the ponytail :)

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Sandman posted 33 weeks ago.

Thanks for the golden girl photos. Ha, brings back memories when we had quality televison;) At least in "Personal Best" they had some real athletes in there. Wasn't Kenny Moore one of the stars? He was a top notch Olympian.

As far as the question goes, I think a long time swimmer with a huge aerobic engine has an advantage. Swimming is the most difficult sport to master. If a swimmer has the appropriate running biomechanics it can become a scary combination.
I had the opportunity to train with Scott Molina a few weeks ago. This guy is incredible. He was a fast AG swimmer, 16 min 1500, and by 15, was running 120 miles a week. That's the kind of guy who is going to excel, and he did!!