Quantcast

Chiropractic adjustment equals faster runs

armyjive's picture
Posts
47
Member
1458 days
started by armyjive on January 12, 2008

Just got done with 2 sessions this week. I havent had issues, just wanted to start getting adjusted, and boy do I feel better. I also have been running fast (I did a 3 mile splite at a where I started at a 6:30 mile pace and ended with a 5:24!!!!!!!!)

I think this will help my with my 10k split on some of the Olympic races I have planned....anyway, just trying new things!

Anyone else get the same type of results when they got their body "cracked"?

~Chris

~Go hard or go home - Chris Loranger

kylie's picture
Posts
4339
Member
1594 days
kylie posted 39 weeks ago.

I find that regular chiro stuff is helping me training at high intensity with fewer injuries. I get regular adjustments and regular massages.

big 3's picture
Posts
216
Member
490 days
big 3 posted 39 weeks ago.

A good chiropractor is a great resource. I go to mine anytime I've got a tweak of some sort, not just my back. I'm talking shoulders, knees, feet... It keeps recovery/down time to a minimum.
If you don't have experience with chiropractors and you aren't sure if you've got a good one. It's my opinion that if your chiropractor does Kinesiology to determine what adjustments he should make, rather than just cracking away and sending you out the door. You've got a good one.
My guy will test me before the adjustment and again after to make sure his adjustment made an improvement.

armyjive's picture
Posts
47
Member
1458 days
armyjive posted 38 weeks ago.

Thanks a lot man.

~Go hard or go home - Chris Loranger

stewarba's picture
Posts
435
Member
455 days
stewarba posted 38 weeks ago.

What should one look for in a Chiropractor? I went to one about a year ago and honestly after 3 sessions, I didn't feel any different and generally just felt like I was talking to a quack. This guy believed that every ailment of the human body could be traced to the spine and with proper adjustement could be fixed through chiropractic care. I have a hard time following that logic from a scentific perspective. I have been told there are two schools of thought on chiropractic care - I'm not sure which (if either) is the best from an athletic perspective.

Pain is the sensation of weakness leaving the body!

gfd's picture
Posts
664
Member
988 days
gfd posted 38 weeks ago.

My one experience with a chiropractor was a poor one. The person was not qualified to work with a person that participates in endurance sports and admitted so and told me that return visits would not be productive.

If I feel the need to return to a chiropractor I will search for one with an athletic background or who works with athletes. Maybe a local college or high school athletic director could provide a reference.

olivestri's picture
Posts
117
Member
272 days
olivestri posted 38 weeks ago.

My father is a Chiropractor and I've been going for years. Originally to correct some mild scoliois. These days I go somewhat regularly to treat aliments that come from working in an office, tending to the farm, trying to get back in shape, and, for you nay-sayers, to treat common colds as well as maintaining general wellness.

I'd say the MOST IMPORTANT thing about finding a good chiropractor is to find someone you are comfortable with and whose adjustments your body responds to. For some people a particular chiropractor's adjustments may be too rough, but for others that may do the trick.

There are way more than 2 schools of thought in chiropractic, but more importantly, two doctors from the same school will give different kinds of adjustments and treat injuries/aliments differently. Not to mention the variety of ways (or schools of thought) of performing an adjustment: gonstead, thompson, distraction, activator - to name a few.

So again, to put it a different way, chiropractic is a very personal experience, the doctor's energy, how they use their hands, and how they transfer that energy into your body will come from the core of that doctor's being. So underscore the need to find a chiropractor that does things in a way that works for you.

For triatheletes I think it makes sense to search out a chiropractor that has experience in or is familiar with sport medicine or physical therapy. At the very least, an athlete's chiropractor should be comfortable dealing with or adjusting extremeties, i.e. arms, wrists, feet, hips, and so on.

big 3's picture
Posts
216
Member
490 days
big 3 posted 38 weeks ago.

I'd also go with younger chiropractors. 40 years old or younger.
I say this because I believe that the field of research has really picked up over more recent years. So the schooling has become quite a bit more "Focused". I believe this to be true in the field of massage therapists as well.
Acupuncturists on the other hand, find the oldest one you can find ;-)

stewarba's picture
Posts
435
Member
455 days
stewarba posted 38 weeks ago.

olivestri wrote:
So again, to put it a different way, chiropractic is a very personal experience, the doctor's energy, how they use their hands, and how they transfer that energy into your body will come from the core of that doctor's being. So underscore the need to find a chiropractor that does things in a way that works for you.

I am not trying to offend anyone when I say this, but it is this particular part that I have a hard time understanding. The inference that somehow there is a spiritual connection between chiropractor and patient does not jive with my belief system and why I ultimately stopped going.

I would rather have someone tell me from a medical perspective "I am going to bend you like a pretzel in order to fix the discomfort in your right leg you feel when you run for long periods of time."

Pain is the sensation of weakness leaving the body!

olivestri's picture
Posts
117
Member
272 days
olivestri posted 38 weeks ago.

Hey Stewrba - it's okay, I'm not offended. Something to consider, however, if you don't believe it, i.e. it is not a part of your belief system, then I am not surprised it did not work for you. A lot of Chiropractors (and other well-rounded folks) will tell you that you that healing starts from within.

I'm not offended because you are where you are - there are a variety of doctors available to treat people at a variety of levels and according to a variety of belief systems. My post was only to offer my perspective to others here, and was a "response" to yours only in that I felt you overstated somethings and were missing information in others.

By the way that discomfort in your right leg is probably coming from your hip.

big 3's picture
Posts
216
Member
490 days
big 3 posted 38 weeks ago.

I hear what you are saying stewarba. It sounds like you definitely didn't have a good match. It's unfortunate that the only way to shop for Chiropractors is to go in for a visit. Unless there is a health fair or something I suppose.
My Dr. is very straight ahead. You need to create space for the nerves to pass through. If they are compressed then they aren't going to work properly. Same concept with ankles, knees, hips... you need the full range of motion or eventually you have even more problems from compensating for the injury.
I was a skeptic at first, now it makes me crazy when people have pains and don't give chiropractic a try. It's amazing how quickly some problems go away.

I guess I'm saying if you find a good one, you won't regret having spent so much time looking.
I'm in central NJ, I could give a few recommendations if anyone is interested. Just send me a message.

tri-ac's picture
Posts
1716
Member
1039 days
tri-ac posted 38 weeks ago.

olivestri wrote:
if you don't believe it, i.e. it is not a part of your belief system, then I am not surprised it did not work for you.

i'm with stewarba...faith really shouldn't be part of the fix.

kylie's picture
Posts
4339
Member
1594 days
kylie posted 38 weeks ago.

Like many have said, you have to find one that works for you and that understands where you are coming from. If anyone needs a recommendation in the Southern CA area (mine is by Pasadena) let me know -- he is a certified chiropractic sports practitioner (it's an after-degree program option).

gfd's picture
Posts
664
Member
988 days
gfd posted 38 weeks ago.

I would definitely go to see a Dr. that has the sports practitioner degree. Didn't know it existed and didn't see any in the yellow pages last year when I had my problem.

kylie's picture
Posts
4339
Member
1594 days
kylie posted 38 weeks ago.

I'm not sure how common it is, or even if all would list it in an ad -- the chiro target audience isn't often sports folks. But sometimes you'll see "CCSP" with the name on the card, or you could ask about it. Chiro is still a less-regulated territory though, so I still would use a recommendation from a friend/family/coworker/etc first.

watrbg2's picture
Posts
137
Member
1318 days
watrbg2 posted 38 weeks ago.

Also, look for a chiropractor who is certified in Active Release Technique (ART) - it worked great for me.

'In a world that tries its hardest to separate us from what matters, the Ironman helps us to reconnect with the pulse of our lives." - Scott Tinley

olivestri's picture
Posts
117
Member
272 days
olivestri posted 38 weeks ago.

tri-ac wrote:
olivestri wrote:
if you don't believe it, i.e. it is not a part of your belief system, then I am not surprised it did not work for you.

i'm with stewarba...faith really shouldn't be part of the fix.

i'm not really talking about faith as much as i am talking about energy. the energy your body creates and how you direct that energy. but we are probably talking about the same thing.

anywhooo... in this department, because it is your health not mine, i do not see the need for any big disagreement here.

although i did want to point out that "faith" or whatever you call it, is part of the mix whether you like it or not.

see ya at the races

tri-ac's picture
Posts
1716
Member
1039 days
tri-ac posted 38 weeks ago.

olivestri wrote:
although i did want to point out that "faith" or whatever you call it, is part of the mix whether you like it or not.

i hear you; i can see that...it's pretty fascinating that that's why placebos work...the old mental component of healing

cjhoffmn's picture
Posts
320
Member
404 days
cjhoffmn posted 38 weeks ago.

Over the years I've had good and bad experiences with Chiro, ranging from "why did I just waste my money with that weirdo" to "Wow, I couldn't move my neck before I went in, and look at me now, I feel great."

I also had a close friend who's wife became a chiro and learned much about the "energy/healing from within" ideas. I tend to agree with the idea that there has to be a real link of some sort to bridge the gap and conceived the following idea at one point:

The human body has many amazing abilities to heal itself and restore order in its internal systems. But like any system, it can't do so unless the brain is getting the information it needs to allocate those abilities and resources. To the extent something is wrong - cold coming on, something not working right etc., the central communication method is the nervous system, which of course comes together in the spinal chord, protected by the spine. So I reasoned that if the body is going to heal itself, the brain needs the most accurate feedback it can get to allocate resources. If chiro can increase or help the nerves' communication then there's a basis for how chiro can help with all kinds of strange ailments etc.

Just a wild thought on the topic.

To tri or not to tri - that's not a question at all!

CarlyBoy's picture
Posts
57
Member
481 days
CarlyBoy posted 38 weeks ago.

Haven't stirred the pot in a while, so why not?

Whatever works for you, but.. here goes.. chiropractic is a legalised cult not unlike Scientology. To call the practitioners "doctors" is a stretch. You wouldn't go to a regular doctor for "maintenence" visits so why go to a chiro for them?! This is nothing but a very well executed marketing scam. If you don't hurt, why are you going to a "doctor"? If you feel adjusting (cracking) your spine is beneficial, try a simple "trunk and hip stretch" (eg here http://www.orientaldancer.net/articles/stretch2.shtml). Works for me every time and the price is nice.

Any injury, sports related or not, finds me at an MD. If the injury is soft tissue related I am always encouraged to visit a physio. Never have I been referred to a chiro. With any luck the only practitioner I visit regularly during training is a licensed massage therapist.

Over the years I have found regular stretching (morning, midday-ish, before bed) to have been the most beneficial form of preventative maintenence. It's free, all you have to do is MAKE TIME FOR IT.

kylie's picture
Posts
4339
Member
1594 days
kylie posted 38 weeks ago.

Well I disagree. But then again I also go to my MD for regular physicals and check ups. I prefer prevention to curing. And I don't tend to go to MDs for sports injury. An answer of "just don't run anymore/for a while" just doesn't work for me. I find traditional western medicine address symptoms more than the root of the problem, and that approach isn't the one I want. Instead I go to a chiro with a great knowledge of sport and related injuries, and I've had great success with it.

I'm not going to argue that the chiro field has a wide variety of folks in it, but claiming it is a cult like Scientology is a bit farther than I'd take it.

As for the term doctors, I call my college professors that as well. It reflects a level of formal education completed.

csaf31's picture
Posts
55
Member
969 days
csaf31 posted 38 weeks ago.

After suffering from cramping legs at a series of races, I needed to find something to help me. A runner suggested a chiropractor. I was skeptical to say the least at first. Needless to say, I found the right one. My chiro has a background in long distance running and is very familiar with all the injuries that occur in endurance sports. Weekly sessions of helping me get stretch out in addition to electro therapy has made a world of difference in how I feel during and after races. I owe much of my race improvement to the better flexibility gained during these sessions.

CarlyBoy's picture
Posts
57
Member
481 days
CarlyBoy posted 38 weeks ago.

Hmm, thought I'd get way more bites to my post.

Kylie, I suspect many of your college profs likely were doctors (phD), but certainly not all. I addressed my university profs as "professor". This may be a local tradition. In Germany it would be inappropriate to address a male phD with anything other than "Herr Docktor __" (Mr. Doctor), for example.

Interesting to hear your assessment of western medicine as treating the symptoms. This has not been my experience (unless you consider the common cold which can only be treated symptomatically). Proper assessment of injury by a (hopefully sports-oriented) physician is always the first step. Different injuries can present similar symptoms. Upon visit to a responsible chiro with an injury, that chiro should direct you to a physician before proceeding with adjustments, stretching, etc. Suppose you have a fracture or torn ligament. Clearly this calls for a period of recovery, and, yes, you will have to "just not run for a while". This is an extreme example, but I think makes the point. Unless you are a MD yourself I would say a "great knowledge of sport" could eventually backfire on you in the form of an incorrect self diagnosis.

I too prefer preventative maintenance. If paying someone for regular stretching and adjustment when you could do it yourself (see my post above) makes you feel better, that's fine. We all have priorities...

stewarba's picture
Posts
435
Member
455 days
stewarba posted 38 weeks ago.

I mentioned earlier in this post that there was a connotation from people that Chiropractic care was somewhat spiritual and based on some of the responses I would say that this is true for a lot of people that go seek treatment from a Chiropractor. CarlyBoy, I would tend to agree with you, but I always say "to each his own." The mind and a person's beliefs are powerful things and if you believe that the treatment is effective, it probably is for that person. Just like the football player sucking on oxygen or the person who jumps in an ice bath after a hard workout thinks it helps him recover even though there is no scientific evidence (or at least that I have seen) that would support it. But, if that player sucking on oxygen or the person who jumps in an ice bath believes that it helps - it probably does.

Pain is the sensation of weakness leaving the body!

big 3's picture
Posts
216
Member
490 days
big 3 posted 38 weeks ago.

As for Chiropractors vs MD's making the most out of extra visits. This happened to me.
I'm going to take the long road on this story.

I had severely cramped/spasming muscles in my lower back. So much so that when sitting in a chair I couldn't straighten my leg out past about a 45 degree angle. So I went to the MD. He then sends me for Physical Therapy. Which I think is great.
So the PT (physical therapist) hooks me up to some electro stim (rapidly pulsing electric which causes the muscles in that area to relax contract). The concept here is to fatigue the muscles to the point that they can no longer hold the spasm. Once it releases your muscle from the spasm then the vertebrae moves back into place, no longer hitting the nerve causing the spasm.
Of course we did some strength training and stretching as well.
Well the next morning as I'm stretching out. I hear 2 pops in my lower back and I'm afraid something just went horribly wrong. In fact the opposite was true. I was cured right then and there.
Sadly that's not the end of this story. Of course I had been "approved" for 10-15 visits to the therapist. So I go in as scheduled every two days. I go in the next time and tell him I'm cured. Well he suggests we continue with our plan. So I was getting zapped and stretched and strengthened for a couple few weeks and all was well....
Until I went in first thing in the morning one time rather than at night after work like all the other times. Of course I'd been feeling great for a couple weeks so I was back to doing all my normal stuff. That day after my visit I decided to mow my lawn. Takes me all of 20-30 min to do that. Then I walk inside and my back gives out and I'm lying on the floor. Easily the most pain I've ever felt in my entire life. I'm twisting and turning and trying to get myself into a position which will relieve this pain. There were not many that would work. It was insane.
I'm am now in much worse shape than I was when I started a few weeks ago. So I go back to my main Doctor again to tell him what happened. (I had to lie across the back seat of the car to be able to make the trip without going into back spasm.) The Dr. decides I had better get an MRI and then go to a Neurosurgeon to read the MRI and decide what is to be done.
The neurosurgeon tells me I have an "extruded disc" and that I should have it removed. (I was 30 when this happened, back surgery wasn't what I was hoping for). He said if not that only thing he could do for me was to give a cortisone shot into the disc. I didn't want to do that either.
So I go back to my Dr and tell him what my options were and tell him I'd like to see a chiropractor first before cutting me. He won't refer me. I tell him I'll find one myself. He tells me he will see me again soon. (nice right?)
So because I still had my MRI pictures. I take them into the Chiropractor with me. He looks at the extruded disc area and tells me that it isn't obvious that is what is going on there. Meaning it's not enormously extruded if it is at all in fact.
My back is in so much pain it is unreal. I tell him I'm actually terrified to be adjusted as it might cause so much pain and I won't be able to take the pressure off the nerve to get it to stop. He assures me that he is going to make very subtle adjustments using my own body weight lying against wedges to begin with, I'll be fine.
I was going 3 times a week to get this problem fixed. (seeing how I couldn't go to work, more often sounded good to me). I don't remember now how long it was before I was back to being able to move without massive spasms, no more than 2 weeks for sure. Within a few months I was doing well enough to golf. He had me doing the PT Strength and stretching as well.
So I avoided the knife. Now I'm curious if anyone reading can tell me where the mistake was made. It didn't occur to me what had really happened for about half a year or more.

Here it is: I seem to be a freak with electro stim. The settings they use on me are higher than anything they've seen anyone tolerate by many multiples. In fact on many of the visits to the PT at the beginning if someone new was giving the treatment, I remember they would go and ask the main Dr if the chart was correct for the settings. Then they would always ask me to tell them if it becomes painful at any point, they would re-adjust.
So there it is. What's the point of electro stim? To fatigue the muscles to the point they can't hold a spasm. Well they certainly aren't going to hold me upright either!!! All the visits up until that last one, I would go home and relax and then sleep. That last one was in the morning and I had a whole day ahead. I was never warned to take it easy. In fact my PT was always done after the electro stim, so it never occurred to me.
When I finally realized this, I was upset. I was thinking about how I was cured after one treatment. Yet they had me go back for 10+ times and eventually sent me into this world of pain which took months to fix. Not to mention $$$. Yet truly what was I going to do about it? I could prove nothing. It had been months.
So the good part of this is I found a really good chiropractor. He does adjustments to feet, knees, shoulders..... Heck he works/worked with olympic teams, obviously if those guys find it's an advantage, how can you say differently?
Lastly, I hope anyone that reads this will remember that if they ever have electro stim treatments, that they consider what's being treated and rest appropriately.

As for the battle chiropractic better than PT or whatever.... What do you call the guy that finished last in his class at Med School?
Doctor
Wish everyone the best in finding a good one for all areas of health!

PS: obviously I no longer go to the Dr that wouldn't send me to a chiropractor.

CarlyBoy's picture
Posts
57
Member
481 days
CarlyBoy posted 38 weeks ago.

stewarba, I think you're exactly right about to each his own and the power of the mind. The pure oxygen thing is a good example - scientifically no benefit. But who is going to tell that to a professional athlete?

big3, I do hope your back problems are behind you (awful, sorry). I had a similar course of diagnosis/treatment as you. It was variously piriformis/herniated disc. I was not ready to entertain surgery (it was suggested). Excruciating pain (manifested in hip/high hamstring region). In desperation I went to a highly respected chiro. I explained I was registered for IM in a scant 7 weeks. Like you I was terrified an adjustment would near paralyze me. He assured me it wouldn't. He tried his best but after a half dozen visits with no improvement, I abandoned the treatment and withdrew from IM. Unfortunately, the wait time for MRI in my area is long and I wasn't going to pay $1000 to travel to a city that would do it. Wouldn't have mattered anyway. Whatever I had done, it obviously just needed to heal - took the better part of ten months to even feel 80% - good enough to try easing back into training. I was stupid and broke the 10% rule and paid a hefty price. Injuries that take that long to heal are severe (disc, torn muscle, etc). In the meantime I did a lot of research. I learned that for the majority people who have back problems, the culprit is usually weak core/abs. I don't know the numbers on a big scale, but I can tell you that the majority of triathletes I trained with at the time did little or no abs work (including me). With the limited time in our busy lives, we tend to focus on swim, bike, run. I am now diligent with my abs/core and stretching. So far, so good.

beads1985's picture
Posts
4667
Member
1676 days
beads1985 posted 37 weeks ago.

I agree with the fact you have to have the right 'fit' with a Chiropractor. However dismissing them as not a 'Doctor' is a disservice to the profession. Like Kylie, I go to a "Doctor" M.D. for my regular physicals, etc.. He is under 50, very progressive, is a great believer in holistic medicine, and does not just give out prescription for every ailment.

My regular Doctor, along with traditional methods recommends a chiropractor, massage therapy and acupunture as methods to achieve wellness and to maintain your health.

He understood the maintenance methods of chiropractic and compared them to changing your oil in you car and taking it in for regular preventitive maintenance, or in the case of an athlete, changing your shoes every several hundred miles or maintainind your bike. I doesn't take care of itself, and by the time there is a problem it may be too late.

My doctor, an accomplished M.D. and also a PhD, goes to a chiropractor, a massage therapist and an acupunturist. I take his recommendations seriously.

I go to my chiroprator an a fairly regular basis and I know it helps.

Nothing to it, but to do it

Anton's picture
Posts
2833
Member
1318 days
Anton posted 37 weeks ago.

I'm in with Scott here..
I have an MD, a guy I really trust, tri head, runner and all around great guy.
He will often suggest herbal remedies over drugs, thinks chiro works well for some folks and believes in massage therapy. HE sent to the chiro the first time!
We do not practice preventative medicine in this country. The insurance companies don't allow it. So I pay for my yearly physical out of pocket. Go to the Doc at the first sign of trouble...and that includes the chiro if you have one that you like and works well with you.
If chiro is a cult ...then triathlon is, even more so.

"What would life be if we had no courage to attempt anything?" - Vincent Van Gogh
My Blog: http://agingsuperhero.blogspot.com

stewarba's picture
Posts
435
Member
455 days
stewarba posted 37 weeks ago.

Next time you drive through medium to large city and see the large buildings on the skyline, take a close look at the names on the side - 75% of them will be that of a bank or an insurance company. Both are masters at making money off of others!

Pain is the sensation of weakness leaving the body!

armyjive's picture
Posts
47
Member
1458 days
armyjive posted 37 weeks ago.

I can not believe the amount of posts that have been generated by this topic. I need to thank everyone for their input. I think that we all need to find "what is right for us". I think I may need to find someone that does more than just back problems and work with other joints and what nots. I will be doing some searching online and the yellow pages soon.

I still hgave two more weeks of twice a week care. I am still feeling grteat and runninglonger and harder than ever before. Maybe it is just mental...

~Go hard or go home - Chris Loranger

ChunkyB's picture
Posts
997
Member
362 days
ChunkyB posted 37 weeks ago.

Anyone have any low-budget alternatives to chiropractic visits and massages?

"The melting point of wax means nothing to me": Thrice

My Blog

armyjive's picture
Posts
47
Member
1458 days
armyjive posted 37 weeks ago.

The cheapest way I think is to crack my own back and stretching after a long bike ride...hehehe. I pay money out of the pocket because my insurance does not cover where I am going. I have Kaiser, so it may be tough...might be something to check into.

~Chris

~Go hard or go home - Chris Loranger

armyjive's picture
Posts
47
Member
1458 days
armyjive posted 37 weeks ago.

I saw my chiropractor today and I feel great!

~Go hard or go home - Chris Loranger